How to Break the Covid Bad Work Habits

[Tom Pounder] Today we're going to talk about how you can break the COVID bad habits. Are you ready? Because it's time. [Announcer/Intro Voice] You're listening to the Church Digital Sidekick Podcast, part of the TCD Podcast Network. [Tom Pounder] hey heroes my name is tom pounder and this is the church digital psychic podcast this is the podcast where i bring on ministry leaders and we talk about how you can do ministry more effectively in this very digital and online world and we are no strangers to bad habits that we've developed over covid listen covid started two years ago and we've developed a ton of bad habits and it's breaking those bad habits have been really hard. Me in particular, I've had a hard time breaking the COVID bad habits that I developed. And so I brought my friend Corey Sullivan on. Corey's a great friend of the podcast. He's been on a number of times. And we're gonna talk about how you can break those COVID bad habits and restore your mental health a little bit. Again, I'm no mental health expert, but I do know that I developed some really bad habits over COVID and I need to break them. So Corey and I discuss a few tips and tricks that you can do to help break your COVID bad habits today. But before we do that, I do want to just highlight the Church Digital. At the Church Digital, we have a ton of great coaching cohorts. podcasts and blogs that will encourage you in your life and in your ministry so if you've never checked out the church.digital go there now i've got the links in the show notes below so we would love for you to connect with the church digital today all right so we're getting ready to get into the interview right now with corey sullivan but before we do that i do want to highlight this interview took place not just a few weeks ago but a few months ago i want to see if you know based on the discussion corey and i have when this conversation happened if you know definitely hit me up on twitter at ta pounder or email me or you can just put in the comment section. I would love for you to see when this conversation took place and what the outcome of that conversation was for the rest of the year for that particular topic. All right. So now, without any further ado, let's get in the conversation right now with Corey Sullivan. All right. With me right now is my good buddy, the one and only Corey Sullivan. [Cory Sullivan] hey how you doing tom good man how are you doing uh i'm doing good i'm always excited to get on a podcast uh and hang out and just share some thoughts and um you call me buddy i didn't know how i felt about it at first just to be honest with you the first thing i thought of was i ain't your buddy pal and there's an old tv show that goes back and forth uh with that [Tom Pounder] i was thinking of that gift from uh burt reynolds and smoking the bandit when it's like 10-4 good buddy like you're my good buddy like no so yeah well we are we are good buddies they're just odd that you're you called me that yeah okay well i won't call you buddy ever again so just you know you don't have to okay yeah so man how's it going dude [Cory Sullivan] Good, I'm actually today's a weird day. I'm going on like two hours of sleep like it was like a weird night last night where I just couldn't sleep. But then at the same time the Buffalo Bills. Crush the Kansas City Chiefs. And so it's a good. It's a good day. You know I'm a bills fan so. We've seen some bad days and I think this is a big hurdle for us as a football team and I'm not going to rub it into a certain friends face. until we actually win the Super Bowl. And that's going to get rubbed in his face. [Tom Pounder] I wonder whose friend that is. I don't know who that person might be. I wonder if he's listening. [Cory Sullivan] His name's Stan. I think he's been on the podcast a little bit too. [Tom Pounder] Stan's been on the podcast. He's definitely been on the podcast and he's been our friend. And again, at the time of this recording, the Bills record is what? What is it right now? [Cory Sullivan] Three and one. No, I think 4-1. [Tom Pounder] Because the Cowboys are 4-1 right now. So it's like one of those things. [Cory Sullivan] The Cowboys are a good team. I would have minded the Cowboys-Bills Super Bowl. That would have been one for like the 90s. You don't have to bring back all the 90 graphics for that one. [Tom Pounder] Yeah, when the Cowboys won it back-to-back against the Bills. That's great. [Cory Sullivan] Yeah, it happened. All right. [Tom Pounder] Moving on now. When you're listening to this down the road, it's going to be a few weeks down the road, we'll have to update and see what the record is of the Bills at that point. It's 4-1, and man, they look good. [Cory Sullivan] They do look good. And you mentioned that people might be seeing the video recording of this, and just so everyone knows, I'm just sitting in my truck, not driving my truck that'd be completely unsafe uh don't zoom and drive people don't zoom and drive [Tom Pounder] Don't drive. That's good. Well, Corey, I'm glad you're back on the podcast. And I actually like to talk to you about these kind of topics, because even though you and I both have a student ministry background, what we're going to talk about involves more than just a student ministry thing involves all of us, whether you're a minister or not. But it really applies to us as ministry people, because we've gotten into a lot of bad habits. And this is a work related thing. We at the very beginning of COVID. We went all in gangbusters going crazy. A lot of us had to learn how to do online ministry for the very first time. And because of that, it became all consuming. There was so much that we were doing and we were working insane amount of hours and whatnot. But right now, at this time, we are a year and a half out of that beginning part. and we're still working insane amount of hours we're still doing things that we can't do like for me and for instance me yeah i i wake up in the morning and i'm on my computer and i'm doing stuff um i'm doing work i have a little breakfast have a little lunch have a little dinner and i keep on working and a lot of times i work until nine ten o'clock at night Only to go to sleep to come back and keep on working. So we've developed some unhealthy habits. And so, Corey, let's talk a little bit about our mental health. Let's talk about how we know when we're doing well and how we know when we're not doing well. So just kind of let's get this conversation going. What do you think? [Cory Sullivan] Well, I think definitely, you know, you're doing well just on your mood, right? Like your mood is going to be positive. You're going to be excited to get out of bed. You're gonna be excited to engage the world around you. You're gonna engage in the activities that you love, right? Like outside of work, right? Like get a hobby if that's you, right? Like we gotta engage in the things that bring us life, not just in toil, right? And so I think you know you're doing well. Some signs of, hey, I've maintained some of those other activities that keep me staying positive, right? My mood is pretty... um positive not saying you're gonna have bad days or frustrating days or sad days but overall the trend is that like you're doing well the the secret question to ask is like your spouse or someone that's close to you like a roommate or a close friend and say like and ask them like hey how are you doing because if you're close to them you're going to see some parallels especially a spouse right you're living together you're married that they're not doing well chances are you're not doing super awesome either even though you might think you are right like something else might be off as well so asking some of those questions and just the opposite like you know you're unwell by missing some of that stuff, right? You're sleeping in longer, you're missing deadlines, your lack of care for certain activities. You're not doing the things that brought you joy anymore. You don't have good routines and good habits, right? So your house is cluttered. The food you're eating is all takeout, right? And it just doesn't clear. I always say a cluttered house is a cluttered mind. it doesn't bring about the focus that we need in some things um and so that's how you kind of know that things aren't going well we and here's the thing is it's all individual like i can say here's some general themes or thoughts but like i would if i were to talk to you tom about how i knew you were doing well right is i would know one the cowboys are winning right and you're doing well i would know um that you're doing well because all your your kids are doing well and that they're safe and so you're doing well i know you're doing well because i'd ask how work is going and you're being you would say like i have some really pretty good exciting projects that i'm excited about right and i would start knowing that you're doing well i would know you would not be doing well right for some of those opposite things hey i'm burdened by like being stressed out at work or you know my Like this is happening in my family life. This is like happening in some of my, I haven't gone on my walk in, you know, a week. I would like, oh, well, why not? And we'd figure that out. Yeah. [Tom Pounder] Well, yeah, I would definitely agree with you on that. There was two things that you said early on in this that really stood out to me. I think one of the ways that I know that I'm also not doing well is when people ask me this question. Hey, so what are your hobbies? Like, what do you like to do? And I'm going to be honest, I don't know what my hobbies are anymore. You know, I used to, I used to have like to go out to the driving range. I didn't always go golfing, but I love to go to the driving range. haven't been to the driving range in years i've been so consumed with work and what i've been doing that i haven't been to the driving range in years and when someone asks me that question of what do you enjoy doing i i have forgotten that about myself and it and it depresses me actually yeah so and so and like i think that's a big one is like the hobbies the things that bring you life and bring you joy and again this is a personal one like you have to ask you're like [Cory Sullivan] if someone was looking at me how do they know i was doing well and what what are the signs or things that i'm not going well like when i used to be a teacher and my my thing is i have to do something physical every morning like whether that's going for a walk or getting a big workout in like i have to do something physical uh as soon as i wake up in the morning and when i was a teacher my students would know when that didn't happen would be like you didn't work out today did you or you missed your walk today and they would just know based on my tone or my mood or my short and it was like oh that's a flag that said like i'm doing well or not doing well like that was a thing that i learned that i needed to do every day is early in the morning do some sort of physical activity yeah [Tom Pounder] Well, and I would agree with you on that. And I think let's talk about this for a quick minute. You and I had this conversation offline. Again, Corey and I are good friends and we talk almost every day. We'll text or call each other. And you and I were talking about. us needing to be a little selfish too now. Corey and I are both big family people. I would describe Corey as someone who cares deeply and passionately about his family. He loves his family, his whole family, and he would do anything for his family. But then I think, and I feel like I am the same way. and sometimes and i look at myself i think okay i do all this stuff for my family what am i doing for me what am i doing to make sure i'm healthy and again if you're a family person there's that that that conflict that you have in your mind that war that you have in your mind i can't do this for me because i have to do this for my family and that's a great mindset to have But we do need to be selfish with our time a little bit. Corey, talk to me a little bit about that, being selfish with our time so that like what you said, so that you can get your workout in or you can get your walk in or whatever it is that brings you that sense of relief. [Cory Sullivan] We have to, I think this is an old, like, I don't like cliches, but it's like, we got to fill our buckets too, right? Like taking care of the family, taking care of work stuff, supervising people, you know, you empty yourself out a lot. And so you got to find the time to, you know, do something that recharges you, that resets the battery. Otherwise you're not going to be as effective, right? Like you challenged me that says like, Corey, you said this, like you got to be a little bit selfish and take that time. Otherwise your son's not going to get the best of you, right? And I want him to get the best of me and for him to get the best of me, I got to be at my best. And for me to be at my best, I got to do a couple things right and that's not a an exhaustive crazy super long list it's a few things. And sometimes that means I have to communicate those things that other people impacts, like my spouse right, sometimes I have to sacrifice one activity over another. Right, sometimes it means I miss seeing my kid for half an hour or an evening right, which I don't like doing but over the the next 18 to 20 years right with them like. those things, you know, I still want him to have the best of me. And that means sometimes I got to take the time to make sure my headspace is right. [Tom Pounder] Yeah, it's the same thing for me. I mean, I need to make sure that I'm getting like a workout in or exercise thing in. I get some alone time. Like, I mean, honestly, sometimes I go to bed a little bit early just to lay in my bed and do a few things for me. But and I feel I feel guilty about that. But I also I also know that I need that me time a little bit so that I can just process the day and process what you want to do. [Cory Sullivan] Like have that think time. [Tom Pounder] Yep. So you and I talked about this, but let's talk about this a little bit more now and flesh it out a little bit. Okay. So if we know we have to be selfish and we have to take time for ourselves, what does that look like? You mentioned this thought of recharging. Okay. How does it look like in the course of some days, some months, some years? What does that look like for you? [Cory Sullivan] For me? like and so the general thought is like hey every day you got to be doing one activity to build yourself up every week you know an activity every month what's the one thing every year what's the one thing and like as the time frame gets bigger though what is it gets bigger right like every day i need to do something physical i also i try and push it and say every day i gotta do something creative like whether that's drawing or just doodling or writing or reading I have to be doing something creative and that's what I do on a daily basis on a weekly basis right I'll try and see a friend or like go out to like a coffee shop like spend time quality time with like a friend not my spouse just someone that I know and I enjoy like on a monthly basis like I want to have like my family time my family adventure like a bigger family adventure on a monthly basis whether that's like going to a local farm or doing something like that for myself. Like on a monthly basis, I love just going and having like coffee shop time. Like go sit at a coffee shop by myself, journal, read. Like that's something for myself. And then on a yearly thing, I need to do like at least two days somewhere by myself. Like, and usually I sneak out, I sneak a day in just from like the work and my work travel. I'm able to do that for a day. here or there like i used to go to a conference with you and some friends and that was the big thing that would be like my reset that i would just do from for me and so we see that on like a yearly basis figure like it's a vacation or it's a trip or you know something that's going to cost you a little bit more and so trying to find those things that helps kind of create some sort of balance and rhythm into life [Tom Pounder] Yeah, I think that's great. I like how you break it down. You got it into the shorter term. Every day, what can you be doing something every day? And again, Corey likes to doodle. Corey's very creative. I always remember in staff meetings, Corey, when Corey and I were in the same church, Corey would be doodling during staff meetings about like taking notes and doodling at the same time. And it was always cool. He's a very creative person. Maybe you're not creative like that. That's OK. Find out what it is for you. Discover what it is for you. I always enjoyed jogging for a long time. I would go on quick runs, two mile runs, almost three mile runs. And that would be it for me. unfortunately over coven i've suffered some knee issues and whatnot and i don't run anymore well i don't run as much anymore but i walk a lot and i use that time as an opportunity for god to speak to me and god to minister to me i'll have headphones on sometimes i'll be quiet sometimes i'll listen to podcasts other times i really use that as me time and i take about 15 to 20 minutes a day to do that And so I think that the more that we can really focus on rediscovering who we are and learning more about who we are and what we do and what excites us is really gonna help us recharge. And again, make us the best us that we can be for our friends and for our family. And I think that that makes us great. And again, it causes us to have long-term success. The healthier we can be now, the better we're gonna be down the road in everything that we do. [Cory Sullivan] Yeah. And I agree with that. And even not just in personalized, but like our work environments that we're in, right. I would just listen to a podcast the other day and I forgot what it was. It might've been Kerry Newhoff. And he was talking about his guests talking about something, an idea called like white spaces and like in your meeting calendars that, you know, instead of having an hour meeting, have a 45 to 50 minute meeting. And that 10 minutes in between the next two meetings is your recharge time. You're thinking, You're processing, you're taking your takeaways. And it's like those little things that we can do at work to help us maintain a balance and be optimizing our capabilities and all those different avenues. [Tom Pounder] yeah i agree and so i think that's great because i i'm gonna be honest you hit on this earlier but you talked about you know are you sleeping in are you missing deadlines and whatnot i i will say another big moment for me an aha moment for me to know that i was unhealthy was when i would get my alarm and i wake up at like 5 30 most mornings and i would hit my alarm and i would be i would literally think oh man I got to get up now. Like, I just didn't want to get up. And on Sunday mornings, me being a minister, on Sunday mornings, I'd wake up and I'd be like, it's Sunday. Like in a depressing type of thing, thinking, oh my gosh, I have to go in there. And it just is not healthy. And the sooner that we can recognize that in us, the better we're going to be. [Cory Sullivan] And the better you are to start processing it, just like, why do i feel this way what do i need to shift at work or in my environment or your mind space right to like figure and navigate that out i think that a lot of stuff comes down to sleep like i was staying up late and waking up early and all of a sudden like i'm getting up at like 4 30 4 45 in the morning routinely and i like it like i like it but i'm going to bed at like nine o'clock at night you know um i know I know, like the chorus of a union would burn, would literally, it's not burning the candle from both ends. It's throwing the candle in the oven, right? And just throwing the whole thing in the mouth. Like I, but I'm learning and I'm trying to grow, but I like my quiet time in the morning, my quiet cup of coffee. I like my, you know, morning devotionals. And by the time I have to get my son up for the day, like I've been up for two and a half hours already, you know, and I'm able to get some other stuff done that I need to and just have my quiet moment. [Tom Pounder] Yeah, I love that. Again, a lot of times I wake up in the early morning to do that quiet time because that's the moment you have that quiet time. And if you're listening to this and you're a parent, you know that, again, you've got to get that quiet time whenever you can get it. Bottom line is that we do need to be taking care of ourselves, and I think we need to be seeking the Lord through this whole time entirely. You know, I love Matthew 6.33, but seek first His kingdom and His righteousness. And all the things will be given to you as well. You know, Jesus talked about how he's going to provide for us. He's going to take care of us. Wherever you're at in the spectrum right now, where you're overwhelmed, overworked, and going crazy right now, or you're beginning to have that sense of relief, or you have that sense of relief, you know, God's going to take care of you. If we seek the Lord and ask him to guide us and direct us, he's going to lead us through. And, you know, we just have to be able to take our pride aside and say, I need help. I need help. And maybe that means going to counseling. I mean, I've been to counseling numerous times, and it's been great to really have someone to pass this on. [Cory Sullivan] I think I was the same counselor for a while. [Tom Pounder] What's that? the counseling too i think we saw the same counselor for a while yeah we did when you lived in northern virginia yes we did so but but it's healthy i mean again the counseling there's so many stupid misconceptions about people who go to counseling or people who do this or that the reality is if you don't have anybody to talk to you go see a counselor someone who's going to listen to you and really guide you through it and i don't even say even if you do have someone you can talk to go see the counselor they [Cory Sullivan] like where a friend can give you advice a counselor can go deeper with you a counselor can say this is where you are and this is where you want to go these are the steps that you can take to get there right a friend can just empathize with us and maybe share some good advice from their experience where some of those more professionals can say like hey let's let's dive in a little bit more to some of this stuff yeah yeah i agree uh completely [Tom Pounder] Well, Corey, as we wrap up, any final thoughts, comments, questions? [Cory Sullivan] I always just want to say, like, what's one more thing? What's the one thing that you can do for yourself to make yourself be better? Right. Like, is it just taking an inventory of, like, why you're frustrated or why? Like, what emotions you've been feeling lately? Right. And saying, I don't want to do that. I want to feel this way. So what changes do you need to make? Right. It doesn't take a lot. It takes you getting quiet. just thinking through like how you doing lately and and deciding to like hey maybe i need to make a change on what's one change that you can make right one step you can take and everything else is just momentum yeah [Tom Pounder] I agree completely. And that's why I had you on the podcast so you can talk about this. I mean, you focus on mental health right now. I mean, in your current job right now, you focus on mental health. So this is important. You've been seeing a lot with teenagers that you've been working with and also adults. So this is an important thing that it won't get any different until we start making the changes and we start adapting and making some changes. [Cory Sullivan] well corey as we wrap up uh what where can people contact you how can they get in touch it would be at my website's www.rallyyouth.com and then i'm always on uh instagram under big underscore sully55 as well and explain the sully thing my last name is sullivan yeah okay I was just saying, what we saw in the beginning, like, what did you think it was? [Tom Pounder] No, I just always liked to refer to it as Monsters, Inc., man. It's Monsters, Inc. Sully, come on, it's Monsters, Inc. That's such a great movie. [Cory Sullivan] It is. Someone asked, I was in, like, a small group the other day, and someone asked, like, you know those icebreaker questions? They're like, what character are you? I go, well, it makes sense that I'm Sully. Like, I'm probably the same size as him. [Tom Pounder] I have a beard like him. and uh we share the same name so there you go there you go that that is true that's great that's great so well corey as always it's great having you on the podcast so thanks so much for being with me today awesome man thanks for having me uh everyone have a great uh day or whatever is happening in your life today [Cory Sullivan] Awkward goodbyes. [Tom Pounder] Awkward goodbyes. Awkward goodbyes. There you go. All right, heroes, did you catch what time of year we recorded this podcast or when we recorded the podcast? If you did, definitely let me know at TAPounders by Twitter handle or you can email me or put it in the comment section. I would love to hear again if you know when this conversation took place. But more importantly, I want to know what you thought about this. What are you doing right now to break your COVID bad habits? How are you restoring your mental health? Definitely, again, hit me up on Twitter at TAPounder. I would love to carry this conversation a little bit more because this is a work in progress. I'm working on it every single day trying to restore my mental health and break these bad habits that I developed. And I would love to see what you're doing to break those COVID bad habits in your life as well. All right, heroes, so thanks so much for being with me today. As always, if you enjoyed the podcast, go and subscribe to it. It's on YouTube. It's on iTunes. It's on Spotify. It's on thechurch.digital, along with all the other podcasts and blogs that we have on there. Definitely, we'd love for you to subscribe to it and listen to it. We've got new podcast episodes coming out every single Thursday, so we'd love for you to be in tune with that. All right, heroes, well, I hope you have a great rest of your day, a great rest of your week, and until next time, have a great one.