How to Maximize Your Sunday Service Throughout the Week

Want to maximize your church's content that you're creating on Sunday mornings? You're going to find out how to do that. Are you ready? Because it's time.

You're listening to the Church Digital Sidekick Podcast, part of the TCD Podcast Network.

Hey heroes, my name is Tom Pounder and this is the Church Digital Sidekick Podcast. This is the podcast where I bring on ministry leaders and we talk about how you can do ministry more effectively in this very digital and online world. And today I've got my friend Ben Stapley back. Ben is a good friend. He's been on the podcast a number of times and he's got a lot of experience about how you can take that Sunday morning content, that content that you're spending hours upon hours upon hours preparing for, but how it usually just stays on Sunday morning. where we talk about how you can effectively take it from Sunday morning and integrate it all throughout the week so that you can be encouraging people in your congregation and reaching the people in your area for Christ. So I'm really excited to have Ben on, and we're going to talk to him in a quick second. But before we do, I want to highlight the Church Digital. At the Church Digital, we've got a great opportunity to encourage people who are doing digital, online, digital, digital church plans. We're encouraging them through cohorts, coaching, through blogs and podcasts, through opportunities to help you grow in your ministry. Again, you guys are on the forefront of doing amazing stuff, and we want to be there to walk alongside of you. So if you've never checked out thechurch.digital, I want to encourage you to go there right now, check it out, and start getting some encouragement in your digital and online ministry. All right, now let's get into the conversation with Ben Stapley on how you can maximize your Sunday morning content.

All right, with me right now is my friend, Ben Stapley. Ben, how are you? Tom, I'm doing great because I'm here talking with you. I got a chance to share with you, but more importantly, I got a chance to learn from you. Today's going to be awesome. I'm excited for this.

Oh man, I'm excited about this as well. Every time that you have so much great stuff that we get to talk about, I love just picking your brain. Again, I learn from you, and if you learn from me, great. But again, I learn from you all the time. Well, you've been on my podcast a number of times, so you're no stranger to the podcast. But just in case somebody's listening or watching for the very first time, quickly introduce yourself and what you do.

Yeah, so I'm Ben Stapley. I get a chance to serve currently as the executive pastor at the Life Christian Church here in New Jersey. Prior to that, I had a chance to serve on the executive team of a couple of megachurches. And then even prior to that, I had my start in my career in television as a producer for a national news program in Canada. So I've been in the ministry green for a while. But before that, I was producing and overseeing experiences in the secular field. And so my passion is to connect with an audience with great content. And so I'm excited for this conversation because that's where we're going towards. How do we do that in a church environment? What does it look like to connecting with our audience and really maximizing the content we've already produced and getting it at the door? Yeah, well, Gus, that was a great lead into the whole thing.

But again, I love picking your brain because, again, you have such great passion with video, photography, with leadership and creative stuff. And so this conversation, I think, is really important because we spend so much of our time, churches do, on Sunday morning. And so I was looking even at our staff, our church staff, and we have so many people dedicated to Sunday morning. It's a shame that you just... keep it all towards Sunday morning. But you're talking about how you can take that stuff and maximize it throughout the week. So what's your encouragement there for that?

yeah i i'll probably break this talk down and my feedback towards you in terms of three different ways first of all like the the why the what in the house so the even before we get to the people always like how do we do this how do we do this i always like to back up and say say the why before it and for me it comes down to three big things for the why first of all to increase your roi again i'm sitting in the executive pastor position So I'm looking at our creative team and thinking, man, we've got a lot of staff members. We've got a lot of volunteers. We've got a lot of fancy gear as well. And then we're using this, but oftentimes it doesn't get much farther than a one-hour experience on Sunday morning, which is a shame. So I'm looking at it from that perspective and saying, we've invested all this time, resource, and money into creating a great experience. How can we make sure it gets its maximum impact? And now I know there's a side conversation here in relationship to, know is the sunday morning service experience um is that the best way where we put all our resources in that's a great conversation that's not this conversation but since we already are putting the majority of our resources into that hour How do we stretch it and make it a bigger impact? That's the first reason why I would say you need to think about maximizing your Sunday experience. The second quick thing is, I'm sure you've discussed it with your community here is, we have 168 hours in the course of a week, but usually we're just thinking about the one. And in terms of your digital audience, I'm sure they're salivating, right?

Yes, yes, yes.

Speak on this, talk towards this. Tell the lead pastor about this. Give me greater resourcing. so i can i can be involved in these digital spaces the other 167 hours in the course of the week not just the one hour for the you know couple hundred people showed up live and then the last reason in terms of the why um you know this is a this is a pretty christianese but it still applies follow the example of jesus so when i say follow the example of jesus what i mean by that is you look at jesus and what he did is he didn't just spend his time with his core, with his trio, right? He had his three, James, John, and Peter that he would often meet with. individually and you know he took them up to the mountain transfer for transfiguration so he had that but beyond that he had his he had his 12. so he disseminated his message beyond the original three the the core three to the 12 and even beyond that you see him send out the 70 or 72 and then beyond that when he ultimately ascends to heaven he says okay now go go go and spread this And you see the concentric circles, Jerusalem, Judea, Samaria. And so Jesus is always spreading his message to a wider audience. How do we do that? Sometimes I think in our church world, we can have a bit of a holy huddle mindset, right? There's just a couple of people here with us, and this is good. This is honoring. And if it's big and if it's expansive and if it's growing, that's actually a bad thing. I would counter that and say, no, no, no. If you look at the kingdom of God, it's always on movement. It's always expanding. It's always widening. That is the model of Jesus. And so how do we follow in that and apply that?

Yeah, I love that because, you know, again, back to the Jesus example, Jesus didn't say, well, come to the synagogue with me and then you can hear me. He preached on mountains. He preached on the countryside. He preached on boats. He preached. He was sharing his message, God's message everywhere. He wasn't just saying you got to come to the church to do this or to hear me say he took it to the people. And that's one of the ways that we can spread that content. And the other thing I love about it is that, again, you've been in the trenches before. You know what it's like to be like you're an executive pastor now, but you've been in the trenches doing this kind of stuff for a really long time. And I love that you as an executive pastor have this vision for your church and for your ministry to go out and say, we need to maximize our content beyond just what we get to do in that one hour every week.

Yeah, and even beyond that, I'm trying to think back from my time. I've been on both sides of the fence. I probably spent the first 10 years of my career being the creative, making the content. And I spent the last 10 years being an executive and overseeing the creatives making that content. So I've been on both sides. And I always remember myself as a creative. It was always more rewarding when more people saw it. Any creative creates to showcase their work. They're not making something and locking it up in a vault. And unless you're some like abstract author and you've just written manuscripts and it's some lockbox that no one's ever going to see. Most artists create. to showcase their work and the wider the distribution and the larger the audience, the more they feel acknowledged by their work. And so I remember as myself as a photographer, right? So I would take a photo and it got printed and put in the lobby. Great. I saw it on our website. Oh, I saw it on social media. I saw it all these different places. I felt my skills and my effort were validated. And so also as a leader, when you think of your creative people, they are going to feel more rewarded and serving the kingdom of god by giving their you know not them but their work and what it represents a larger on again we're not just like you know i got to showcase my artists because they're thin-skinned no but it but to acknowledge it does feel more rewarding on the artist's side of the conversation when the content gets a bigger distribution

Yeah, 100%. I love that. Okay, so you talked about that, but now let's go into the what. What can you maximize? Because I think a lot of people will be like, okay, I get it. We should be doing this, but what in the world would we maximize?

Or they get it, which is great. I'm going to try to keep the cookies on a higher level. I know people listen to this conversation. This is not the first rodeo. Hey, you should get your service online. They're like, yeah, we've been there, done that. COVID hit, we've all done that. And so I'm going to try to get us a little further down the conversation and surpass the obvious stuff to get there at the door. And some less obvious stuff, less obvious stuff for me in terms of what content you can use to maximize. There's a lot of your worship. What I mean by that is, man, basic stuff, basic stuff. I remember going to a church and never knowing what the new songs were. And it was a church that would bring in a new song pretty quickly, like every other week into the rotation. And so sometimes I'd be there even as a faithful congregant. And I'd be like, I don't know half these songs that I'm singing. And there was never any other time in which they engaged me with that music. It wasn't played as pre-service music so I could hear it in the background and maybe osmosis pick some of it up. There was no other way to engage it. There wasn't a playlist that was given. So I'm giving some suggestions here. But beyond that, I saw a church once recently put out on their social media. that you heard from the worship pastor. Hey, Post, we are going to be rolling out the song and singing it for the first time this Sunday. We're excited for it. First of all, here's the link if you want to listen to it. And you feel a little more educated. But beyond that, let me tell you the reason why we picked this song. Right now, we're in this season as a church body, and we feel we need to lift up this particular praise to God because he's doing a unique thing in our... midst and we currently don't have a song that highlights that and so we've hand-picked this and so i mean like i wasn't a member of it like i saw on someone else's social feed but i got excited to come to that church and sing that song i was like oh my goodness like that's that's awesome i'm going there this sunday that is me as a bystander think about your congregation when you're able to articulate what's happening with your music why beforehand and to set them up for success so as you're leading into sunday you know some of this content is is after the fact after sunday hits yeah but a lot of it can be before sunday hits as well this is why we're doing this so there's a lot of different ways to engage people with your music

Can I interject real quick into this? Because I'm actually working on a blog post for the Church Digital right now about YouTube videos that you can do. And one of the things I thought about was just exactly what you pointed out, is that if you're ever going to introduce a new song, that this is an opportunity for your worship leader to get out. And even if he does it acoustically, he plays it for them.

and then again exactly what you said why are we singing the song what does it mean what's the truth behind this i i think that's a great example um ben a perfect example yeah and and sometimes you know i know everyone's gifted differently sometimes worship leaders you know um are gifted singing and playing but you say like hey lead and they're like man i get i get tongue-tied when i do that um even if it was even if it's not coming from you, and I think most worship leaders can do this, but I guess what I'm saying is even if you're parroting somebody else's words, and like the reason we're singing this song is because the author intended what they wrote was this X, Y, and Z. And even if you're bringing in someone else's ideas to the table, to hear that from your worship leader, your worship director, your worship pastor, again, you're leading them through that. So don't miss out on those opportunities. Another quick way I would say is and to utilize the message another how is utilize the message before sunday again a lot of churches do this after the fact right so it's we got the sound bite um i always when i do message reviews with teachers i say you know you're looking at a 30 minute message it's like where's the where's the one minute when is the one minute that's going to hit on social yeah and if you don't have if you don't have one minute you don't have 30 minutes so where's where's your minute yeah um So we do that well. We make the sermon graphic. We take the thumbnail photo of them in that hero pose. We put it on social. We do all that jazz. But what sets me up beforehand? What sets me up beforehand in terms of listening to the content? It's not my primary skill set. On a good day, maybe it's a secondary skill set. Maybe on a bad day, it's a tertiary skill set. But it's preaching. It's speaking. It's teaching. And so for me, when I develop a message, you know, take 15, 20 hours to do that. And a lot of it hits the cutting room floor and it's, it's still good content, but it's not great content. I only want to bring the, I want to be great. So what I'm saying with that is as a communicator, I already have content that doesn't go anywhere. Yeah. I'm still really interesting things. That is great content that could be used to, um, spr sprinkle into your communications. and set up the congregation for anticipation hey everybody i'm i'm jumping into a message on x y and z um one of the things i didn't have time to get into was this greek word here and let i'm gonna i'm gonna break it down just to like kind of wet your appetite to where we're going this sunday The content has already been developed. The communicators thought about it. They've written about it. They're not using it. It's just a matter of them jumping on a FaceTime live, recording themselves while they're driving, posting it on social. A lot of different ways how you can do it. But again, great content to build anticipation for what's happening. coming on Sunday. It develops a sense of FOMO for you people. Oh, this is where we're going. I'm excited to hear it. That's another great way to do that.

Yeah, and I've encouraged my friends as well who are, like, I don't preach very often anymore, but... I have a lot of others who do, and I do. I'm like, give people a preview about what you're doing. Like what you said, give them an anticipation of what's going to be happening. And then I love also after the fact, and my senior pastor has gotten really good at this, is if his sermon is going too long, he'll say, you know what, I'm going to make a devotional about this week. It's a perfect follow-up for people, and you tie it into the message, and you really, again, get to follow up with them throughout the week.

yeah and so on the back end there's a lot of different ways you can take that message content that you can you can use that message extra message content pre and post sunday so you talked about one of the post ways to do right there another post way this was a um wasn't my idea but i was at a church where we were able to do it we launched an app and we knew it was going to take some effort to get people to download and why am i going to download another app um so what we did was we had the communicators you're going to do a four point message and you're going to preach you know for the whole for the whole month you're going to preach three points and then when you get to the end you say you know what everybody's sorry i ran out of time this is supposed to be a four point message uh if you want the fourth point you can get it by downloading our app and the content for that fourth point is already there we got a chance to pre-record it Why don't you download the app? So it created a sense of missing out unless we were able to push people towards it. So, I mean, in a sense, we firewalled that. We gatekeeped that content only on the app. That was the only place it ever played. And so that's another way to think through your message. How to incentivize people with other potential action steps through that core content that you're going to actually keep away from Sunday. You're not going to use it on Sunday. yeah so so okay so that's that's music that's worship um that's message how to utilize message content additionally another thing i tell people is think through your message series at large so okay what do i mean by that i say okay you again your teaching team four five six hopefully not twelve week series um and then what are you doing with that afterwards you can repackage that in a number of different things you can repackage it into a small group curriculum You can repackage it into a blog. You can repackage it into a video-based series. I was, again, at a church where we took that content. It was a marriage and relationship series. And what we did was we quickly just cobbled it together, made a pretty inexpensive e-book based upon it. And then for Valentine's Day, we said, hey, we want you to come on out. And if you come on out, we're going to give away a free e-book based upon a relationship series we've done in the past. And we saw... attendance bump year over year in comparison to other valentine's days because then so we incentivize people in a sense we use that as a lead magnet to draw people towards church you can do that with your series package it up a number of different ways and give it away for free sell it use it as an incentive That's another great way to, in terms of the what, to accomplish that.

Yeah, that's really great. And now what would you say about like other stuff like blogs and podcasts? Do you recommend churches investing in that as well?

Yeah, I would. And that's where I'd probably encourage people. This is a lot of, I'm gonna pivot a little bit here. A lot of what we've been talking about right now has been a lot of polish. It's a lot of high production stuff that's out there. i would encourage people to yeah i continue to do that with the an ebook with a blog with a podcast but what i'd also encourage them to do is to think through how can they pull back the curtain and showcase what's happening. How can they show how the sausage is being made? What I mean by that is there's a number of times where I've been a part with the teaching team and we're talking through an upcoming message series. And I find the conversation, I personally find the conversation very enriching in terms of what are the challenges our culture is facing right now in terms of relationships. And how would Jesus, who is here right now, how would he speak into this? What is the course corrections that he would give us? And what, you know, what did he give us? And those kind of free flowing conversations, even though it's a little, it's not a structure, I find those really helpful. And I'm still, I haven't seen a church crack the nut on this yet. But I would love that behind the scenes content. I would love to see how my lead, my teaching team is thinking when they come towards the series. Now, you know, there may need to be some safeguards on that in terms of, you know, you're going to come back and maybe edit some of the stuff out or maybe it's not enough. This is just raw. And the teaching team that's coming in is aware that we're being captured. Where I'm going with this, Tom, is again, a lot of our content is high polished, but it doesn't feel authentic. And as our culture looks for that authenticity, how do we provide it to them what does it look like in those environments and again You already had that round table conversation happening every time you go into a series with your teaching team. What would it be like to throw on a couple of mics and a couple of just room cameras, not even like high, high polished production, and to capture that and saying, hey, if you're very interested and you want to kind of geek out in terms of why we developed the series or the thinking behind it, take a listen to this conversation with our teaching team, and it'll kind of help inform where you're going. i don't have the solution but i had the problem again the problem is most of our content is high high polish and not authentic and so it lacks a degree of authenticity where are those opportunities where you can bring that in with your content and make it a stronger connection with your audience. And so I'm here to learn from you. I gave an idea to that end. How else do you think we can do that as a church? Because I wanna learn and I wanna apply.

Well, let me go back and just reaffirm what you just said about the authenticity thing. I think COVID changed a lot of things. And one of the things that COVID changed is that it changed vulnerability and authenticity. If you look at TikTok, TikTok has become so popular amongst multi-generations of people. And if you're looking on TikTok, at least the TikToks I'm watching, they're not polished TikToks. They're people just being real authentic. They're sitting on their couch or they're sitting outside or they're walking and people are just talking and being real with people. And I think that really challenged me to say, listen, we don't need this high production stuff. We don't have high production stuff and we can't do the turnaround really quick. But if you're just sitting there real with your iPhone and a simple mic or a simple tripod, you can produce stuff. And I think it really connects with people because they feel like you're speaking with them rather than speaking at them and with this high polished stuff. So I really think that's an encouraging way to do it. Just being real and authentic can really go a long way. It humanizes your senior pastor.

mm-hmm so yeah and um i'm sure you know i'm thinking out loud here again i want to i want to know other applications for it so for me it's the teaching team talking about a series another great application i could see about um i haven't been leading these conversations because it's not my forte but i've been a part and i've always been intrigued when i've been a part of the conversations is with the worship team as they're debating songs which to bring so it's the team you got three people in the room and the each brought a song set and i think we should do this one well let's look at the lyrics you know who wrote it what's the what's the vibe what what are we lacking as a community i find that conversation fascinating i always like i always like learning from other people's trades so you know i had a carpenter recently and i was like what's the biggest problem you have as a carpenter and he's like he's like you know pee stains and it's always fun to learn from people in their craft uh and that worship team man i never knew the layers of thinking that went into a song selection that's fascinating can you think of other applications i'm sure there's thousands but can you think of another particular application for that authentic conversation to be brought to the forefront

Well, I think it's just simple conversations. Like one of the things that we've done a few times is doing some live prayer time, you know, where we get on and do a Facebook live and say, hey, we're going to be praying about this and we would love for you to be praying with us. So join us and have a prayer time online. And that's something that we've seen to be effective. People will give a prayer request and we'll pray right then and right there. I like the idea of, again, highlighting children's ministry, family ministry, youth ministry. They're often like in the background, especially on Sunday morning. You don't see them as much, but they're doing a lot. But maybe like you've said before about highlighting sermon series, maybe it's like, hey, this is what we're talking about with children's ministry. And you can either do a pre-video or even a pre-Sunday video or an after Sunday as a way to follow up with families and just encourage them. You can do some devotionals as well along those lines. So those are some things I think of off the top of my head of how we can tie it in to beyond just Sunday. love it i love it so okay so you've given us some great ideas but here's what what i'm thinking is that some people listening are gonna be like how do i even do that i i don't have the capacity to do all this stuff this sounds great but even the simple things i cannot i cannot put more work on me how do i do this

Yeah, again, I've been on both sides of the camp. So the people who are listening in are like, this is wonderful. I can't do any of this. Let me throw you a life raft really quick in case you're drowning with the potential of overwork and burnout. The first thing is I always encourage people to, you need to build a volunteer team to do this. So if we're talking about taking on a new initiative, most of us don't have just five extra hours in the course of a week. So if you're going to move something forward, you need to do it with the aid of volunteers, with the aid of volunteer, under the guise of volunteer leadership. And so don't start until you have a team. The other thing too is, especially if you're interacting with your lead pastor and maybe they are pitching you ideas, like, hey, we need to take this ground, we need to do this, or you're pitching these ideas. Oftentimes I've used the analogy is it's gonna be a one step back for three steps forward. What I mean by that is, hey, I'm taking time, to recruit volunteers. But because I'm now taking that time to do that, this other thing I was overseeing is going to step back to a degree, or I'm going to have to put that on pause so I can find the volunteers. But here's my guarantee. So we're going to see one step back. in a particular area of my work right now. But I can guarantee you we're going to have ultimately two, three, four steps forward in this area because I was able to find, recruit, and reward and release volunteers. And this thing's going to move forward. And it's also helpful, you know, if you're coaching our listeners right now, If you're leading up to your executive pastor, your lead pastor, your worship pastor, whoever it is, if you're leading up to them, give them a timeline as well. Sometimes it's pie in the sky, right? This is gonna step forward, but I'm gonna move this thing forward. And at the end of the year, like, did that thing ever happen? Like, no, it didn't. so like tell them when this is going to happen as well so if you're looking to to develop this team that is going to take that worship content well who is it and when is it actually going to happen so give them a timeline on that and then beyond the get volunteers i again always encourage people starts slow and then speed up If you're new to ministry, you may have an idealized version of what you want to get done. And you may get it done, but you may get it done because you're burning yourself out. Don't sacrifice long-term gains for long-term. Don't get the short-term gains. gains for long-term consequences. So don't take new ground that is not sustainable and then ultimately burn yourself out. I've seen that happen too many times in my almost 20 years of ministry. And so I always encourage people, start slow and let the thing naturally build up speed instead of taking on a whole lot of stuff and finding yourself overwhelmed, burnt out, and leaving.

Yeah, because again, I love what you just said, because if you start too fast and you go, go, go, and you don't have the proper support like a volunteer team to help you out with that, you are going to, it's going to fall on your shoulders and then you're going to burn yourself out. And I've seen it just as much. Again, we have this idealized version of how it's going to play out, but it doesn't always play out that way. So it's best to start slow, get the pieces in place and then work your way up to getting it. This is what I like to say about with people who blog or do podcasts is consistency matters. And so you can dump a bunch of blogs in there, but if you can't sustain that pace, you're going to burn out and you're going to end up not blogging anymore or podcast anymore. same thing with ministry if you go at a huge fast pace to start with while you may get a lot of compass short term like you said that long-term sustainability is not there you don't have the pieces in place to do it so but that doesn't mean that you don't start at all you need to start slow what's one step that you can take then another step that you can take and you kind of build up to it but you got to have that team around you and they're the great news is There are volunteers out there who don't want to hold babies or don't want to help out with the hospitality team. There are places that people can serve that go beyond traditional church roles that I think could be really effective. We've seen this a lot with our live stream team because people are learning how to do camera work that they didn't know how to do before. They're learning how to do the soundboard. And those are ways that they can serve that they're a little bit more passionate about rather than doing some of these other roles.

Yeah, I had a friend of mine, it transfers into the church world. He's a professor at a college and he's in the communications department. I was like, what's one of the trends that you saw, you know, the past 10 years? And he said, I think he, you know, I don't know when he said this, but it was many years ago, we started to see the students had better gear than the college did. Because so many people were getting into the communication field because the cost was much lower and... And I use that as a comparison that sometimes you will have people in your congregation with better gear than you have that are doing this as a hobby or doing this as part-time or even doing this professionally. Who are those people and how do you get them plugged in? Because again, they probably aren't going to feel invigorated by wiping butts. They are going to feel invigorated by taking photos, posting content. Who are they? How do you find them? How do you get them engaged? Get them off the sideline into the game. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah. Like I said earlier, COVID changed a lot of things and people discovered a lot about themselves. They started having fun. Again, TikTok got so popular because people were home doing nothing and they were doing silly dances or doing different things. And it's just fun to see people create. They can do this for your church as well. You just have to identify them, ask them.

and then see how it goes so i i think that's fantastic um ben this has been awesome what what's one last encouragement or so that you can encourage us with as we kind of think about taking our content beyond just sunday it's not on your shoulders not all it's not i don't say let me rephrase that it's not all on your shoulders so i think sometimes we slash i take the i got i just gotta get the super soaker out and i just gotta hose everyone down with the gospel and the the redemption of the world is on my shoulders and my ability to get more content at the door and so at the end of the day you're participating with god He is using you as part of his redemption plan. But guess what? You're not the capstone of it. His son and his work on the cross is. So rely on that strength. Look towards that as your hope and your motivation and use that as your empowerment to move forward and basically get rid of the Messiah complex because we already have one.

Yes, 100%. Dude, this is awesome. Well, how can people connect with you, Ben, if they've got questions and follow-up thoughts?

Yeah, you can creep on me or connect with me on social media. Most platforms at Ben Stapley. You can check me out. And also, if this is interesting content, you're like, hey, I kind of want a little more of this or I want more help to actually make this a reality. Go to benstapley.com slash coach. I'd love to give you a free consultation and see if I can help you be a success.

Yeah, Ben's a tremendous resource. Again, we've hit each other up on the side as well and just saying, hey, what's this? What's that? Help me with this. And again, Ben's got a lot. His hands are dirty. He's been in the trenches and he knows what's going on. And I just love to see what he's doing. I love following him on social media because he's always talking about his family. You're such a great family guy. And so I just appreciate you and your friendship and all the things that you've taught me over the years.

So thanks, Ben, for being with us today. It was a blast. Thanks for having me on again, Tom.

All right. So what did you think? What stood out to you? What encouraged you? What challenged you? What pushed you? What are some other ideas that you have? Ben and I just talked about a few different ideas. What are some other ideas that you have? What are you doing in your church or in your ministry? We would love to hear it. You can put it in the comment section below. or you can hit us up on Twitter. My handle is TAPounder, at TAPounder, and Ben's is in there as well. You can just click on all his links on his website in the show notes. We would love to carry on this conversation online because again, you spend hours upon hours every single week for Sunday morning. Don't just leave it there on Sunday morning. Make sure you bring it out and use it all throughout the week so you're encouraging people in your community and you're challenging people who are listening to you to grow in their faith. So we want to encourage you to do that. Definitely share your comments below or hit us up on Twitter. We'd love to carry on this conversation online. All right, heroes. Well, thanks so much for being with me today. As always, if you enjoyed the podcast, subscribe to it. It's on YouTube. It's on Apple. It's on Google. It's on Amazon. We'd love for you to subscribe to it at the place where you're getting this, whether it's on video or on podcast form. So we'd love for you to do that today. All right, heroes. Well, I hope you have a great rest of your day, a great rest of your week. Until next time, have a great one.